Let’s see if I can give this a proper stab. Though, I didn’t think I was merely attacking your character, it was an honest thought that I’m not sure that a non-empirical test would satisfy you. If I am wrong please explain more clearly what you meant.

There would be several ways to “know” that “God desires relationship”
1) The first test is that God created the heavens and the earth from nothing. The traditional doctrine of “creation out of nothing” posits that since God is self-existent, without need in any way, to create is an act of pure gift to extend his self-less love to that which is “not him”
2) It is a consistent theme in Scripture
3) Jesus’ resurrection community is both a forgiven and forgiving community, that is, a community built on mutual self-gift with no thought of putting another in our debt

You asked: “But when it comes to a god trying to establish relationships, you think perfect information that shines to make relating easy would be the obvious choice?” on the one hand, but then mocked a possible answer (“God’s ways are not our ways”) because it seems to you not to be good enough.

The question is not “why didn’t God give “perfect information”?” but, “Is “perfect” information possible?” I would most certainly argue that it is not since all information is dialectic, then also our own “knowledge” of God would be a dialectic. And, again, the point is not “information” but “union.” Since the Christian God is transcendent (and imminent), how do you suppose a transcendent being would “transmit” clear and timeless and unsullied truths?

So there is a certain degree of ambiguity and yes, faith, involved in the coming to the knowledge and love of God.

I’m not sure what exactly you think is unreasonable. Could you be clearer as to what you would like me to respond to?

Tony

I vastly prefer to have a dynamic view of the Word of God but as you noted, just because God is without error does not mean that his word, when mediated through the believeing community, are also without error.

One of the problems of modern evangelicalism is the equation of scripture with revelation, I like Ratzinger’s statement, “Revelation goes beyond Scripture, then, to the same extent as reality goes beyond information about it.”

I imagine that unless God were in a test tube somewhere i could say the most wonderful things and you would find all my positions flimsy.

“Finally, I find it sad that in the last paragraph you have to reassure your readers of your deep commitment to orthodoxy while you doubt. “

I was neither doubting nor reasurring. In my last post, I spent most of the time explaining that I didn’t think the Scriptures a merely “human product.” I just wanted to avoid the same discussion.